Last Updated on November 13, 2025
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Did you know that picky eating might not just be “a phase”? If you've ever felt like mealtime with your child is an emotional rollercoaster, you're not alone.
When every plate becomes a battleground over what your child won't eat, it's easy to feel overwhelmed, frustrated, and even like you're failing.
What if I told you that there's a reason why your child only wants pouches, avoids vegetables like the plague, or freaks out over the “wrong” texture?
And that many of the well-meaning strategies you’re using — bribes, pressure, or even just giving in — could be unintentionally making the situation worse?
I know how scary it can feel when your kiddo won't eat. You worry about their growth, gut health, and immune system.
In this episode, I’m joined by Alyssa Miller, RD, a registered dietitian, picky eating specialist, founder of Nutrition for Littles, and mama of three. She is also a podcast host for the Nutrition for Littles Podcast and creator of Table Talk, a Picky Eating Program for families.
Alyssa has a gentle approach for more peaceful mealtimes where little ones can learn to like new foods. She is passionate about teaching moms how to raise healthy, independent eaters, and am dedicated to seeing families have success at mealtimes and seeing lifelong healthy eating patterns start at a young age.
We’re talking about what picky eating really is, the surprising root causes behind it (yes, even gut issues and zinc deficiencies!), and what you can actually do to help your picky eater become more open to variety.
Let’s dive in!
Or, listen on your favorite app: iTunes (Apple Podcasts) | Spotify | Stitcher | TuneIn | Subscribe on Android
In This Episode:
- When picky eating typically begins — AND why it’s a big deal
- Why the “just one bite” method backfires with a picky eater
- How teething, illness, and developmental stages can mimic picky eating
- Common parent reactions that reinforce picky eating habits (even with the best intentions)
- Top signs picky eating is more than “just a phase” (and need intervention)
- How zinc deficiency and genetic taste markers (like for broccoli or cilantro) affect what your kid will eat
- How to know if you’re pressuring your child too much or respectfully introducing foods
- Alyssa’s tips for reducing food waste (or eating it yourself)
- #1 tip Alyssa uses to make mealtimes more peaceful with a picky eater
Quotes
“Picky eating is not just a behavioral issue. It is truly a sensory and nervous system issue.”
“Pressure does not help kids eat better. Pressure helps them hate the food even more.”
Links
Find Alyssa online | Instagram
Check out Alyssa’s FREE workshop for reversing picky eating for good, Get Your Child to Eat What You Make!
Check out the Nutrition For Littles podcast
404: What’s REALLY Causing Picky Eating In Children (And How You Can Get Your Kid To Eat What You Cook) w/ Alyssa Miller RD {FULL TRANSCRIPT}
Jennifer Fugo (00:29.49)
Alyssa, I am so glad that you're able to join me here on the Healthy Skin Show to talk about picky eating, dinner ideas for fussy eater, and more. Thanks for being here.
Alyssa (00:37.582)
I’m so grateful to be here.
Jennifer Fugo (00:40.287)
I'm glad that we know each other well enough that we can have a little conversation with everybody listening in as if we're sitting in a living room having, because this is really tricky, right? Dealing and living with, as a parent, young kids who are picky eaters.
Alyssa (00:56.026)
Yeah, it can be really debilitating to parents.
Jennifer Fugo (00:58.832)
So can you define for us, what does it mean to be a picky eater? Are there things where people think it's picky eating but it's not, versus what actually is picky eating?
Alyssa (01:39.424)
Oh, yeah, absolutely. So it’s really interesting, picky eating doesn’t technically have a definition. So it’s kind of this spectrum, is the best way to describe it, where one night, your kid might just not eat their broccoli, and the parents might say, oh my gosh, they’re so picky. And then another kid, in a totally different home, might only eat one brand of yogurt and one brand of cereal, and those parents will also say, oh my gosh, our kid is so picky. And it’s widely different.
And so, over the years of practice working with literally thousands of parents, I've kind of come up with my own definition. It comes from some of the research, but also a lot of working with the families that I work with. So there's kind of like 10, I talk about this more in my training, there's like 10 different, kind of like a little quiz, I like to call it. Like you remember those old Cosmo quizzes from when we were growing up?
Jennifer Fugo (01:57.818)
Mm-hmm. I do. I do.
Alyssa (02:01.035)
Like, check yes, see how many you have. So I kind of have like 10 of those, but some of the big ones are your kid eats 30 foods or less. You feel, the biggest one I always like to say is, you feel like there’s something off. Like, man, mom and dad, we’re doing the best we can, we’re trying everything and it feels like they’re just eating less and less. So your gut is one of the biggest things, your intuition. If they’re rejecting food more than like three times a week, just altogether, if there’s obvious trends between different flavors, textures, ingredients, like I said specific brands that they’ll eat, if they have a really emotion or strong reaction to certain foods, that’s another good indicator that picky eating is becoming more serious. And one of the biggest ones that I like to tell parents, it’s kind of my first goal when I work with parents, is that they’re not eating from all food groups. We want to make sure they’re eating from all the food groups, they have at least a few goods in each food group, so that they are getting that well-balanced diet so that they’re meeting all their nutritional needs as best we can.
Jennifer Fugo (02:53.682)
So if you have a kiddo who refuses, for example, to eat meat, is that considered picky eating? Or is that maybe more a preference, or is it not clear?
Alyssa (03:06.414)
Yeah, this is really interesting, a lot of parents will just say, well, it’s just a preference, it’s just a preference. And while I 100% agree that everyone has their own preferences, personally there are many foods that I do not enjoy as an adult, I do still work on them. In fact, I actually did a fun experiment on my Instagram about two-ish years ago where I didn’t like mushrooms and I got myself to now, I love mushrooms. I love mushrooms. I don’t like them raw, still, but I like them cooked, I love the flavor. And so I actually was like, hey, this work never ends, like you can always start liking new foods.
So that being said, there’s of course gonna be preferences that our kids end up having for one reason or another. The goal, as a parent, is really to say, I’m gonna continue to expose you to all foods as often as I can so that I don’t make that decision for you. Because oftentimes, as adults, if you don’t like a food, like let’s say mushrooms, for example, it might be because your parents never fed them to you. It might be because you only got the canned, gross, disgusting mushrooms, which is 100% all that I ate, were the slimy, sliced, crappy mushrooms, excuse my French, for kids. But it's like the gross stuff. I never got the fresh, delicious mushrooms, I never got to go out and pick them at the farm, I never got to experience what mushrooms could be. And it was always like a pizza topping, or randomly thrown into like a stir fry, it was not elevated and given to me in a way that was like, it tastes good, this is unique, and healthy, and different, and fresh, and all these things.
And so, as parents, our job is to expose them to all these different foods in different ways so that we don’t make that decision for them. Because, yes, ultimately they’ll end up with preferences, and that’s totally fine, but we don’t want to make that decision for them in childhood. Does that make sense?
Jennifer Fugo (04:45.219)
It does. One thing that I was thinking though, too, is like, and so I don't work with kids and I don't have kids. So I think this is a conversation that I should disclose that, so that parents who are listening to this, if I ask a stupid question, have some grace for me.
Alyssa (05:00.925)
Oh, absolutely. And I’ve got three kids, so we balance out.
Jennifer Fugo (05:03.732)
Okay, so you got me covered. I have nieces, so I've seen the experience that my sister has gone through with them. And so when you say a picky eater, does this mean like a baby where you're introducing foods, or is there a certain age where you should start, as a parent, like you should start being like, hmm, something doesn't seem right.
Alyssa (05:33.998)
Yeah, I love this question. So I want to back up a little bit. So babies, when they first get introduced to solids, you’re gonna experience what maybe someone else might call picky eating. Like you might meet some of that criteria, but they're just simply learning to eat for the very first time, all they've had is liquid food. So at six months, you're introducing solid food, they are like, what in the world? I always like to think like, they're like aliens.
Jennifer Fugo (05:50.895)
I love that. Yeah.
Alyssa (05:52.824)
Like they truly are like aliens coming to this world for the first time being like, what are we doing here? Why are you putting something in my mouth? So it's so wildly different for babies. So there's something called the flavor profile window, so it's about six to 18ish months where that's where parents really want to capitalize. If you want to try and prevent picky eating and get your little eater to eat as many foods as possible, that’s the time to do it. Now, don’t go crazy, I’ve seen parents absolutely burn themselves out, like a new food every day. And remember, not only do you want new foods, you want repetition. So we don’t want to be, well, they had mushrooms once between the ages of 6 months and 18 months, and they ate it, so it’s a check mark, right?
Jennifer Fugo (06:22.042)
Right, right.
Alyssa (06:24.713)
We want that repetition to really ingrain in them that they enjoy this food, they recognize it, they can understand it, and that just takes time and brain development. So that’s the flavor window. Then we typically see picky eating start creeping in around age two, so about 24 months up until about two and a half is like the peak window of picky eating. And you know, parents always hate when I say this, but I think it’s so important to know that, just developmentally, picky eating is, quote unquote, normal. It’s important, it’s an important developmental milestone for our kids to start to question what’s going in their mouth. They’re developing autonomy, they are starting to literally toddle away from their mom and dad, so it’s gonna be less safe for them to just put anything in their mouth that’s nearby.
And anyone who’s a parent knows that your baby goes through a stage where anything you hand to them goes in their mouth. And it’s a really important stage for them to develop their mouth, and mouth mapping, and knowing where everything goes, but then you don’t want them doing that forever, right? Like you and I don’t walk around just like, I wonder what this wall tastes like, like we’re not gonna do that, whereas babies really do. And so you want them to develop a little bit of, quote unquote, pickiness, so they’re not picking up a marble and putting it in their mouth, they’re not picking up something poisonous. Like I was on a hike with my nieces and we found some berries, and I’m glad that they’re not just like, let me eat 30 of these before Alyssa can ChatGPT it and make sure it’s not poisonous, right? That’s so important.
Jennifer Fugo (07:41.338)
Right, right.
Alyssa (07:43.814)
So a little bit of pickiness and kind of discernment is really important for our kids to learn. But what happens is, I love to call these picky popportunities. If something happens that’s developmentally appropriate, but parents look at it and go, oh my gosh, my kid is picky, and start freaking out, typically the only tools they have in their toolbelt are what was taught to them or what they see other parents doing, and then they actually make picky eating worse. They reinforce it unintentionally. This is not on purpose, we love our kids, we want to keep them safe, and healthy, and developed correctly. I mean, I can’t even tell you, probably even as an aunt you’ve heard this messaging, how important these first few years of development are for their long-term health, their brain development.
Jennifer Fugo (08:19.745)
Gut microbiome.
Alyssa (08:23.248)
Oh, love the gut. We could talk about the gut all day long.
Jennifer Fugo (08:26.621)
Gut, and also allergies, because I work in skin, you know, there's a lot of kids where they're developing allergies to foods and then they're not introducing.
Alyssa (08:38.814)
Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Jennifer Fugo (08:40.106)
And I've had allergists, for anybody listening to this who's like, oh, no, no, I was told or I read I should delay food introductions until two years. They realized that was a huge, huge mistake, and I've had people on the show who've said that was bad news. We really set kids up for a disaster in terms of that.
Alyssa (08:59.015)
For decades, for a long time.
Jennifer Fugo (09:02.617)
I think that's one of the reasons why the goal should be, as you said, the stated goal should be to create this environment where they can discern whether they like something or not, but that the diet is various, and there's a lot of variety and in colors, textures, different macronutrients, etc. But what are, so keep going, what are some of these, what did you call them? Picky eating popportunity?
Alyssa (09:33.419)
Popportunities, picky popportunities. I should trademark that. I love it, it’s one of my favorites.
Jennifer Fugo (09:35.107)
All right. So, what are some of these picky popportunities?
Alyssa (09:40.278)
Yeah. So one that I ran into myself was teething. So this is a normal developmental process, you want them to get their teeth. What happens with kids when they get their teeth, and I have a visual in my training where you see what they’re going through, it’s like the teeth are constantly popping through the gums, it’s so painful. I mean, I’ve had tooth pain as an adult that I can remember and it’s painful, so I can imagine what they’re going through. So they have all this swelling and this pain in their mouth. And what happens is, as they’re babies they get some of their front teeth, it’s a little bit of an easier process, per se, like it’s not impacting their life very much, they’re still drinking their milk, their formula, whatever.
And then you get to the two-year-old molars, somewhere between two and three they get these molars. And as parents, we can see their teeth, you might not think, it’s not in the forefront of your mind for them to be teething. But they’ll be teething, they’ll be getting their molars, and then they’ll just stop eating, or they’ll only eat cold foods, or only eat certain textured foods, like soft, mushy foods, pouches become a huge thing that parents rely on. And then, unintentionally, parents just end up going, well, at least they’re eating, so they keep giving them pouches, they keep giving them cold foods, and they have not realized that this teething stage might have been passed already. And so then we double down, and now it’s like, well now, over the last 30 days, they’ve had pouches every day, so of course they’re gonna want pouches, of course they’re gonna prefer it because it’s what they’re exposed to the most. So that’s one of my favorite picky popportunities I talk to parents about.
Same thing with sickness. You know, there’s a lot of developmental ones that kids go through that parents misinterpret. Misinterpret to be picky eating when, in reality, it’s just normal development, and if we know how to respond, or rather, even not respond, play it cool, keep going, keep offering foods, then it doesn’t necessarily double down into picky eating. But a lot of times parents get in their fear, you know, people who are listening to this podcast know how important nutrition is, right?
Jennifer Fugo (11:30.457)
Yeah, 100%.
Alyssa (11:32.834)
Like, they already know. And so watching your kid no longer eat meats, no longer eat vegetables, no longer chew their food, only want pouch food, your brain goes on spiral mode where you’re like, oh my gosh, this is so important. Not only is food literally important for them to stay alive, but then you know how important nutrition is, especially for these first few years, it can make us do kind of wonky, crazy things.
Jennifer Fugo (11:53.425)
Well, as a parent, though, what do you see, like how does the parent react to this? Like, you as the mom, you're watching this happen, and whether it's, listen, sometimes it's mom, sometimes it's dad, sometimes it's grandparents that are really helping to get meals on the table and whatnot. What's the experience like for the parent that, I would imagine this is really frustrating, to say the least?
Alyssa (12:23.026)
Oh, yeah. My key response was rage. Like I had so much anger, where I was like, why won’t you eat this? I just spent this time and this money making this food, I know that you need it, and he would just, my son, my oldest son who really started me down this entire career path. I was already a dietician, but after having him be picky, I quickly pivoted into picky eating specifically. And I would get angry, other parents get worried, sad, hurt, like personally, like I’ve spent time on this food, and they take it really personally. There’s all sorts of emotions, and so I just want to validate all of them because they’re all coming from a place of absolute love for this child, for your relationship.
We oftentimes have a picture in our head of what family meals will look like. What it will look like to share a meal with our kids, and how to enjoy family meals, and dinnertime, and lunchtime, and we’re gonna go on a picnic, and we’re gonna pack all this cool food, and we’re gonna go to the grocery store. And then when it’s not happening, we’re like, what the heck? Like, what is wrong? And either we’ll blame ourselves or we’ll blame our kid, neither of which is actually to blame. And so, really, it’s our lack of information of what’s going on, what they’re experiencing. You know, I don’t want to say, this isn’t quite the right way to say it, but it’s almost like a lack of empathy or understanding what they’re experiencing at the table, and so we just go into parent mode, where how we were parented around the table oftentimes comes out of our mouth. It’s like those moments where you’re like–
Jennifer Fugo (13:45.445)
Yeah, finish your plate. You gotta finish your plate before you can get up from the table or whatever.
Alyssa (13:52.107)
Yes. And you swore, your 11-year-old self promised you would never say that to your kid, and here you are, you’re like, oh, what just came out of my mouth? So, oftentimes we’ll just repeat those same cycles that were done to us. I mean, I’ve heard stories of people sleeping under the table because they weren’t allowed to leave the table until they finished their food, trying to pretend to eat the food, then going to the bathroom, spitting in the toilet, and flushing it down the toilet, feeding it to the dog. I mean, every possible scenario has been told to me of what was done to them at the table. And even if they don’t go that far, where they’re like, well, then you’ll sleep here, they still have an instinct to go, no, you’ll finish your plate, otherwise you can’t do X, Y, and Z.
So, we start to get into this realm of what I call pressure tactics. This is super common, again, the fact that you’re doing this, there’s no shame here, is because you love your kid and you know how important nutrition is. So you step into, typically, some pressure tactics. Those can sound like hey, just take three more bites of your chicken, and then you can go play your toy, or play video games, or go outside, or whatever the reward is for your kid. Hey, just try a bite, and if you don’t like it, you don’t have to eat it. Hey, try a bite, and you can have ice cream for dessert. We start to really prioritize rewards like dessert, or ice cream, or fun things, or something like that, or we withhold things. Hey, if you don’t eat your breakfast, then you can’t go to the birthday party that we have planned later, or whatever that might be. That’s a really easy thing for parents to step into.
Or, parents completely step the opposite way, maybe because they were parented with pressure tactics, where they just go totally passive. And they’re like like oh, well there’s nothing I can do, we talked about this before we started recording, it’s just a phase, it’ll pass, I’ll just kind of white-knuckle it and deal with it until, hopefully, they get themselves out of this phase, they move on from it. And oftentimes, because the messaging around picky eating is so flippant, that it is just this phase, parents think that it’ll be quick. And let me tell you, it is not quick. In fact, most of my audience, now, obviously, it’s skewed data because it’s picky eaters who are following me.
Jennifer Fugo (15:45.457)
Sure, sure.
Alyssa (15:48.276)
But most parents struggle with picky eating three, four, even five years before they start to see any sort of reprieve.
Jennifer Fugo (15:54.684)
Oh my gosh.
Alyssa (15:55.728)
And if we think about, the developmental window is six years for them to develop their brain, their gut health. It’s those first six years, so, so important for their long-lasting health, how tall they’re gonna be, how smart they can be, all of these brain synapses happening. And so, really, that’s not time we can waste, in my opinion, I think nutrition is so, so critical to getting them all the nutrition that they need at a young age to set them up for the rest of their life. I don’t like to add that kind of pressure on top of parents when they’re already doing the best they can, but it is important.
Jennifer Fugo (16:24.56)
And I would also say, I have the experience of working with teens into adulthood. And I would argue that I see a lot of teenagers, even, being extremely picky to the point, like the parents have just totally given up, but the kids are eating. I mean, I'm the one having to be like, listen, you're not eating any protein, like this is really important for your development. And fortunately, I've only had one or two teenagers say that I was mean. I mean, I don't know, I'm here to be honest about things, and to just try and encourage and nudge them into the right direction.
But we then see that persist into, you had mentioned to me before we started recording, this period of time where we, actually, well, not we, because I do not have kids, but in general, adults lose control of their children because a kid goes to college. And so they're not even at home eating the food that at least you had some hand in making. They're now off at college, or working, or whatever, and they're eating pizza, hot dogs, a lot of things that we know, as adults, probably isn't setting the stage for healthy adulthood. So I think to your point, addressing this at an earlier stage allows for a child to develop a palette that then can be carried with them, and they can then use discernment. I mean, listen, there's gonna be things that happen in life, right? I got food poisoning from Thai food and I'll be honest, the flavor palette of Thai food is a little, still, tough for me.
Alyssa (18:19.825)
Yeah, no longer, that’s fair.
Jennifer Fugo (18:21.936)
But again, you can use some discernment of when to eat it. But now I'm like, oh, let me try this. I got into that, it took me, I was a really picky eater kid.
Alyssa (18:30.197)
Oh, okay.
Jennifer Fugo (18:32.826)
But it took me into my 30s, almost, to wanna start trying things. So my picky eater foods breakfast was an English muffin with American cheese every single day, a peanut butter and jelly sandwich for lunch, and then maybe some pasta with maybe, maybe some chicken at dinnertime. And that was pretty much what I ate consistently for years, and years, and years. And it set this, when people go, well, why do you have, for example, all these, persistent gut issues? I was on antibiotics a lot as a kid as well, which that didn't help. So as an adult, it's like dealing with constant Candida overgrowth and all sorts of things because I created and set the stage for a gut that was dysbiotic. I'm not saying like I'm a bad person for that, but I do wish, in some regard, that maybe something had happened, some interceding action had happened, if my parents in the 80s knew that they could do things, that that would be better.
Now, I do wanna ask you quickly, is it possible that picky eating could also be a sign of maybe something a little more serious with the child's health? And are there some like warning signs where you're like, you know, that could be like a GI issue, like an actual GI issue, or something like that?
Alyssa (19:54.018)
Yeah, absolutely. And I mean, it’s hard to know how far back to go, because there’s research to support that their gut is forming while you’re pregnant, and what you’re eating impacts their gut development, and the first few of life, specifically even the first six months of life, their gut is still fully forming. So there’s a lot that parents can do in those first six months to set them up for success. And then, yeah, absolutely there’s, so my entire approach to picky eating is root cause approach. Let’s figure out what that root cause is, and there is certainly a root cause that is completely devoted to their gut health, their physiological health. You know, a zinc deficiency is a huge one, if they’re deficient in zinc, they will not be tasting food the way that food should be tasted, and so then they won’t eat it because it tastes bad to them.
Jennifer Fugo (20:43.246)
Oh, yeah.
Alyssa (20:45.297)
So even something as simple as zinc deficiency can cause picky eating, and then you’re fighting with the kid, literally power struggle after power struggle, to get them to eat this food that tastes horrible to them. You know, there’s even genetic markers that certain foods, like broccoli is a big one, parents all want their kids to eat broccoli, there’s actually genetic markers that broccoli, to some people, tastes like sulfur.
Jennifer Fugo (21:06.062)
Really?
Alyssa (21:07.176)
So you are just feeding your kid this broccoli, yes. Same thing with cilantro, have you ever heard that with cilantro? That’s the more common one.
Jennifer Fugo (21:09.937)
Yes, I do know cilantro, yeah.
Alyssa (21:11.387)
Yeah, so cilantro, to some people, just for anyone who’s listening who doesn’t know what we’re talking about, cilantro, there’s a genetic coder that, for some people, my mom included, cilantro tastes like soap. So when I put it in my guacamole and she comes over, she goes oh, what did you do to this guacamole? Everyone else is loving it and she’s complaining, and it’s not a me-her issue, it is literally coded in her that cilantro tastes like soap. Same thing with broccoli, there’s several different foods that are that way.
So sometimes parents are pushing something because they have a desire, like it kind of goes into that identity thing of I want to have a healthy kid, and if I want a healthy kid they must eat broccoli, and if they don’t eat broccoli then I’m a bad parent. None of that is true, right? None of that is true, but it’s what we don’t even realize is the belief we’re holding onto. And if our kid has the genetic marker that broccoli tastes like sulfur, we’re not gonna go anywhere fast with that belief. Again, going back to that, so absolutely there’s a root cause that could very well be not only their physiological health, but also their ability, literally the ability, to chew food, to mash it into small pieces to be able to swallow it safely, to feel. Like I was talking about earlier, the mouth mapping, which is such a funny word, but essentially, some kids don’t develop the ability to know where food is inside their mouth, so they’ll pocket foods in their cheeks, this is really common. Now, I don’t wanna worry any parents.
Jennifer Fugo (22:31.377)
No, this is interesting.
Alyssa (22:33.186)
Just because your kid’s doing this doesn’t mean they have an issue with mouth mapping, it means they’re still figuring it out, they’re still learning, they’re very young, but sometimes they won’t literally know that food is in there. And could you imagine how scary that would be for our nervous system to have food in your mouth and not be able to find it to swallow it or to spit it out? That would be very alarming.
Jennifer Fugo (22:45.209)
Yeah. Wow.
Alyssa (22:49.198)
And so then we have a fear cycle that’s going on inside the kid’s head that then goes, I’m not gonna eat food if I don’t know that I can just immediately swallow it, which is when you start to see kids who really prefer things like applesauce, pouch-type food. This is getting, again, I told you I was gonna put on my nerdy glasses for this.
Jennifer Fugo (23:06.129)
No, please!
Alyssa (23:08.447)
But it goes down the route of, if you notice that your kid really prefers pouches and really smushy, mushy applesauce-like textured foods, smoothies, things like that, it’s because when they eat it, especially for a pouch, it goes directly from the tip of their tongue down their throat. When you give someone steak, like when you and I are eating steak, we first bite it with the front of our teeth, then it moves to the side of our mouth, we chew it up, we might switch sides, you know, we get a little tired or who knows, whatever. Then we go into this type of chewing which is essentially, I don’t know if people can see this, but essentially your teeth are grinding it into some sort of circle to be able to really mash it up to make it safe to swallow.
If your kids can’t move the food around their mouth, they can’t get to that kind of grinding motion with their teeth, they’re not gonna feel safe swallowing it. So a lot of kids who don’t prefer meat may just not have the skills to be able to mash it up to a safe place. So then, they’re not saying, hey mom, I don’t feel safe with this chicken in my mouth, I don’t want to eat it anymore. They’re going, I don’t like that, I don’t wanna eat that.
Jennifer Fugo (24:04.064)
Right, I don't want that.
Alyssa (24:07.187)
I don’t want that. Again, it’s communication, where we’re not recognizing what’s actually happening.
Jennifer Fugo (24:11.514)
Right.
Alyssa (24:12.402)
And their nervous system is going, I’m in danger, I’m in danger, and you’re going, it’s chicken, you’re fine.
Jennifer Fugo (24:18.437)
And just to play devil's advocate, this isn't something that like, wouldn't the pediatrician or the dentist notice this, or it's not like, does it often get overlooked?
Alyssa (24:36.185)
Yeah, so doctors in general have, and I’m sure you’ve looked into this, less than one class in nutrition. On average, I think it’s one full class in nutrition, and they have to cover all kids, all adults, all stages, all ages, so they just simply don’t have the knowledge of the resources. So oftentimes when you talk to your pediatrician, they will just brush it off and say it’s just a phase, it’s no big deal, it’ll pass. Do the best you can, right? And that’s hard in my profession, because they do have such a voice to be able to say, hey, there’s alarm bells going on here, you need to go get an evaluation.
And it’s not until parents, on average, go see the doctor four times specifically for picky eating that the doctor goes, okay, let’s do a speech or eating evaluation. And then they have to, in America, and honestly in the whole wide world, I haven’t met anyone that has a better process anyways, but you get on a waitlist to go get an evaluation, those waitlists can be, before COVID it was like three or four months, now after COVID it’s now like seven, eight, nine months. I have parents DM me all the time, I’ve been on a feeding evaluation list for months. Then they get into the evaluation, they get evaluated, then if they do say, oh yeah, you need feeding therapy, it’s another few months, usually, for wait until they’re able to get it.
Jennifer Fugo (25:42.257)
That could be like a whole year.
Alyssa (25:44.018)
Oh yeah. Yeah, it can be so much time. Now, if you don’t have that experience, I’m so happy for you, that’s amazing that it’s quicker for you.
Jennifer Fugo (25:50.833)
Right, wonderful.
Alyssa (25:52.603)
That’s not always the case for a lot of parents. And, like I said, you already have to go see the doctor four times to get even that, on average, that feeding evaluation, unless you really are a squeaky wheel about it. And a lot of parents just hear this messaging where they’re like, oh, well it’s just a phase, it’ll pass, and they tell themselves like, you’re obsessing over it, or you’re not as capable in this role. Like a lot of parents are just kind of hands up, I can’t do anything, it’s my kid, they’re really difficult, they’re really stubborn, and they go, I can’t do anything about it. When, actually, the truth of the matter is parents are perfectly positioned to help their kids reverse picky eating because most kids aren’t gonna wake up and go, you know what mom, I would love to have broccoli for breakfast. They’re not gonna do it themselves. It’s your role that you can step into if you want to.
Now, listen, I once had a neighbor who had a picky kid and she just told me, right to my face, she knows what I do for a living, she’s like, I just don’t have the capacity for it. And I support her, I’m like, that’s okay, that’s okay that you don’t.
Jennifer Fugo (26:47.834)
Right, you do you.
Alyssa (26:49.284)
You do you, you have so many things on your plate. So I do wanna make that really clear. I know that I’m really passionate about picky eating, obviously I’m very biased, I know you really care about nutrition, so there’s a lot at play here. But as parents, I also get when we’re at capacity, and it’s just maybe a not-right-now thing we need to focus on. That being said, I don’t want you to not focus on it because you think there’s nothing you can do to influence it because there’s so much we can do as parents. We have so much power and influence over what our kids eat and how they experience food.
Jennifer Fugo (27:17.369)
And so, if you had one, because I know that you've also got a really great training to help parents who are maybe sitting here going, this is me.
Alyssa (27:30.239)
Yeah, yeah.
Jennifer Fugo (27:35.329)
Like, totally I'm guilty, and I've been trying, but I feel like I'm really desperately failing. I've asked my pediatrician for help. They don't have, like you said, don't have the capacity, don't think it's an issue, don't have the expertise, I'm not sure what to do, but I know that this, I'm concerned. Because a lot of parents, and grandparents, and caregivers who listen to the Healthy Skin Show are deeply invested in making sure that their children are getting the best start humanly possible because we don't get a do-over. That's not what happens, in life there's no do-overs. Like you stressed, this can persist for an excessively long time. This can persist into adulthood.
Alyssa (28:16.738)
Oh yeah, daily, yeah.
Jennifer Fugo (28:18.098)
I get to see that, that end of things where it's really hard to get people to even just eat healthy fruits like strawberries and berries. Like they just don't like the texture, they don't like the consistency, they won't eat meat because they don't like the consistency. I mean, these are very common things. So to say it's just a phase, it may be, it might not be, but if you are persistent enough, what are some things that parents could start to do, or maybe even just think about right now, that might be like an initial couple of things? And then obviously, and I'll link to it, you've got this whole free training that will dive deeper into this that I think would be an amazing resource for anybody who's looking for this, and I'll link that up.
Alyssa (29:04.187)
Thank you, yeah.
Jennifer Fugo (29:06.725)
But what do you suggest?
Alyssa (29:07.998)
Yeah, and I just want to touch on this because, again, the reason why I do what I do is because I was in your seat. So whoever is listening, I 100%, I didn’t expect, I had a baby who ate everything, and I know that’s not always common either, he ate everything, and then he just started getting pickier and pickier and I didn’t know what to do. Even as a dietician, even aced all my tests, passed my boards, and still had no idea what to do, and I just felt like, okay, I know how important nutrition is, I don’t want to get in power struggles every day. It was getting to the point of just feed him whatever he wants, put him to bed, and then me and Josh would enjoy a meal together because I really loved enjoying meals with my family, and like I said it wasn’t matching that picture. So I just want to encourage anyone, there is never any shame. Literally the reason why you’re doing some of the things you’re doing that I’m saying not to do anymore is because you care and love about your child. So I just wanted to remind any parent out there.
And you kind of mentioned it too, with like being on antibiotics a lot as a kid, and if you’re struggling with kids who get sick all the time this is like a hack. Like if you reverse picky eating, you get them eating in all the food groups, multiple foods, and have a good gut microbiome, illnesses go way down. And I never like to publicly talk about it, but, my family gets sick, for sure, it’s not zero, but way less than most other families in our school systems and my friends because, I think, our kids eat a really well-rounded diet. So it’s kind of like a cool hack, you’re like, okay, well my kid now is healthier and gonna grow up healthier, and they’re sick way less often, and parents know what an inconvenience it could be to have sick kids everywhere.
Jennifer Fugo (30:32.905)
Oh my, oh my, everything, I know plenty of parents who are like every, my kid, once a week, comes home and they're sick, we get everything, it goes through our house. And that's an awful spot to be in.
Alyssa (30:44.288)
Yep. Yeah, that’s an immune system that, and I mean, always there’s multiple facets, right?
Jennifer Fugo (30:50.329)
Of course, of course.
Alyssa (30:52.498)
Again, you have to take my view of nutrition with a grain of salt because I love it so much, but it is important. So back to your question about what can parents do. So, I love this question because I’m a very tactical, hands-on person, and when I started learning that pressuring my kid, or I call it like guilting, bribing, begging, pleading, demanding, all of those sorts of things fall into the pressure category, and when I first learned not to do that I was like, yeah, but like, what do I do?
Jennifer Fugo (31:15.793)
Right.
Alyssa (31:17.473)
Okay, you just took away all my ammo and all my tactics, and now I just sit there and stare at them while smiling? Like, okay, keep going. Even praising, it’s so wild, even praising your kid could be a form of pressure, especially if you have a natural people-pleaser, someone who really wants to please their parent, whatever. So it’s all pressure. But every kid is different, and that’s why I take the root cause approach because even if, let’s say you have a kid who has no people-pleasing tendencies, well then for your kid praising isn’t pressure. So it’s important to know your kid and it’s kind of like a tango and a dance at the table.
So I would say, a few places to start. First and foremost, you’ve got to give them the opportunity to eat these foods, you gotta put it on the plate. And a lot of parents just go, oh, they’re not gonna eat it anyways, why am I gonna buy it, why am I gonna take the time to make it, why am I gonna put it on their plate, it’s just gonna go in the trash. You have to change your version, or view, of what food waste means because a lot of parents, like myself, can get really triggered, especially in this economy, don’t even have to get started on that, with wasting food. I spent, you know, eggs are insane, my kids ask for eggs and then don’t eat them, I’m boiling. There’s the midwest part of me of like, I can’t afford to pay for the garbage to eat this food, right?
Jennifer Fugo (32:27.801)
Right.
Alyssa (32:28.766)
So we have to, I actually had a really cool thought exercise for myself that came up when my son was learning how to write. And he was coming home with, and parents will know, mounds of paperwork from the school, but I was like, should I be keeping all this? Like, this is just the letter H twelve times. So I was throwing it away, and I recognized, recycling it, of course, but I recognized, like, this is the cost of learning, like it takes paper, and markers, and pens, and time for him to learn how to write. And I want him to be able to experience the world and write, and read, and create, and be artistic, and all these things, but he needs those skills to do it one day in his life.
And so this is the cost of learning, and I think of food waste the same way. It may go untouched, they may lick it and then not eat it and it goes in the trash, or maybe you can save it for later. I love leftovers, I think it’s a great little hack for serving the same food over and over again. But it's okay that your kid isn’t eating everything off their plate, and if you’re getting triggered by food waste, it might be something to look at.
The second hack is kind of two-for-one because it helps with food waste, but it also helps your kid not feel overwhelmed. Just put less on the plate. A lot of times parents put how much broccoli they want their kid to eat on the plate, and then they’re watching this big mound of broccoli not get touched, and that triggers food waste issues, that triggers power struggles of how much they need to eat. Put less on the plate, you’ll be surprised, if you also create a culture of allowing them to ask for more and fulfilling their request for more.
Jennifer Fugo (33:54.405)
Interesting.
Alyssa (33:56.400)
Where they’ll feel less overwhelmed, less threatened. I mean really, seriously, going back to the alien analogy, think about how overwhelming that could be if there’s a food they don’t like and they see a mound of it.
Jennifer Fugo (34:05.893)
A mound of it, yeah.
Alyssa (34:07.477)
Even if their favorite food is right next to it, they’re looking at that broccoli, there’s expectations built into the broccoli being on their plate, and their alarm bells are going off. And you’re like, yeah, they’re gonna eat it this time, then they don’t eat it and then you get frustrated. So put less on their plate, it keeps them from getting overwhelmed, keeps you from triggering, I call them tripwires. I think there’s a lot of ways that we can set up our kids for success, but also us up for success where we’re not tripping on these tripwires to go into power struggles. Like, if I don’t put a mound of broccoli on their plate, my brain naturally doesn’t go, they need to eat that whole thing of broccoli, do you know what I mean?
Jennifer Fugo (34:42.768)
Right.
Alyssa (34:43.381)
It’s like a tripwire for me not to get into a power struggle. So that’s another tactic, putting less on their plate. The next one is what I call the division of responsibility, or rather, excuse me, I don’t call it that. I do, in my practice, but someone else coined it, Ellyn Satter coined that term and I absolutely love it, it works so well. And essentially it just says, hey, at the table we have different roles and responsibilities, or swim lanes, if you will. I’m in charge of what food gets put on the plate, what comes into our home, what gets put on the plate, how it’s prepared, and then I serve it to my kid. And my child, their lane is deciding if they’re gonna eat it, and if they do, how much.
And if we get that one thing right with picky eating, where we’re deciding what gets made, so our kid isn’t saying make this, make this, make this and we’re giving into all their demands, like short-order cooking, which is very easy to get into as a parent of a picky eater. We decide what goes on the plate, they decide if they eat it and how much of it, which means we’re not saying three more bites, we’re not saying you have to take a bite before you can be done, we’re not saying you have to clean your plate, we’re not telling them how much or even if they have to eat it. That can help immensely with our picky eaters. Now, I want to talk about what you can do, because those are a few things that you don’t wanna do.
Jennifer Fugo (35:54.208)
Right.
Alyssa (35:55.938)
Still, again, it’s like, well, what do I actually do? So, number one, my favorite tip to give parents that’s actionable right now, you can do it right after listening to this podcast, describe the food that they’re eating. Literally, as you put a strawberry on the plate is a great example. You would sit down and eat that food with them, so I guess that's another little tip if you’re not already eating with them. I know it’s easy to set them up at the table and then go clean up the kitchen or tidy up the room, I’m totally guilty of doing that too. Sit down and eat food with them that’s the same, try to have your plate be the same.
But then, when you’re eating your strawberry, you can go, oh my gosh, this is so sweet, it’s so tart, it’s so delicious, it’s juicy when I bite into it, it’s crisp, or maybe it’s more mushy, whatever it might be. Describe what you’re experiencing. Our kids, not to bring it back to aliens, but they don’t know, they’re not able to remember the last time they saw a strawberry. They’re not making as many context clues as you are, and so being able to describe a food to them goes a long, long way, especially, actually I have a great exercise in that training you mentioned.
I have a great exercise walking parents through what it would be like to be like their kid experiencing food for the first time or not remembering what food is. And so I would highly, highly recommend it, only just for that part alone because it’s such an interesting thought process of wow, I really do need to describe these foods to my kid because I have 30 years of experience eating grapes.
Jennifer Fugo (37:17.263)
Right, we know.
Alyssa (37:19.736)
They have maybe one. Right, they know. And so it’s really interesting and really important to explain things to our kids. So I think that’s a great first step of what to do.
Jennifer Fugo (37:26.929)
I just wanna share too, just as an adult, that's a really interesting perspective shift because honestly, I don't think about, now, what it was like as younger me trying all these picky eater foods, they were just gross, right?
Alyssa (37:41.038)
Right. Yeah, it was just a no.
Jennifer Fugo (37:44.029)
They were just gross. It was no, it was a hard no. And now I would probably talk to someone, I'd be like, no, it's good.
Alyssa (37:52.838)
Right.
Jennifer Fugo (37:53.388)
That's probably what I've said to my nieces. No, it's really good, you should try it, you should eat that. And they're like, no.
Alyssa (38:02.376)
You’re right.
Jennifer Fugo (38:04.376)
No, I don't like this, that, and the other. And again, I'm not a parent, but I probably haven't dived into, well, why exactly don't you like it? And they may also, to be fair, depending on their developmental level, might not, as you shared, be able to really clearly articulate the issue. I mean, frankly, a lot of adults can't always articulate the issues.
Alyssa (38:22.409)
Oh, yeah. Right.
Jennifer Fugo (38:24.092)
So for us to expect a child somehow to be like, you know, mom, I have this whole, like my stomach gets gassy and all this stuff, like that's not gonna happen.
Alyssa (38:35.033)
Oh, no. Yeah, it’s exactly right. And I mean, just think about like, if they’re staring at a food, like chicken or something that they don’t have a lot of experience with, they have some, and their only experience with it was maybe when they were a baby with baby food, or maybe they’ve eaten it here and there but they can’t remember, it’s like literally standing in front of a cave of unknowing. Like, you’re just like, I don’t even know what to expect. So, simply by explaining your experience with the food and not just good, bad, like it, don’t like it, juicy, tender, soft, sweet, tart, tangy. Use these words to describe food just gives them a little, kind of just shines a light in that cave a little bit. Like, oh, this is a little less scary.
Jennifer Fugo (39:12.817)
Yeah, you're like their food guide, almost. Wow.
Alyssa (39:17.398)
Yes, totally, yeah. And a lot of parents just expect, and this is normal, you just expect, like, yeah, just pick it up and eat it. That’s a very intimate thing to tell someone to just do. Like, put this in your mouth and swallow it. That’s such, like if you really step out of the context of our daily life, I mean imagine being blindfolded and I just walk up to you and push something in your mouth. You’re like, what did you just do to me?
Jennifer Fugo (39:33.457)
Yeah. Listen, Alyssa, if you brought me to a completely different culture and I've never had their food, the first thing I'm gonna be like, and this happened when we saw each other last week, we went to a restaurant and I was sitting there with other, we were at different tables, and I'm like, what is that?
Alyssa (39:56.839)
Yep, I don’t know.
Jennifer Fugo (39:59.019)
I'm trying to look it up on my phone, because I'm like, I don't, I don't know what that is, and we got no explanation.
Alyssa (40:05.398)
Exactly.
Jennifer Fugo (40:09.287)
I think we were at the Greek restaurant, or Mediterranean, and I was like, I don't know what's what, and I don't know what that is, so even as an adult. And if I was an alien going to another planet, I don't think I would just sit down and go eating anything, right? So you are giving me a perspective shift that I did not realize was even possible.
Alyssa (40:25.702)
That’s good, yes!
Jennifer Fugo (40:28.487)
I don't have kids and this is making me actually think very differently about food, and potentially how I can even explain this to teenage clients or even adult clients.
Alyssa (40:36.248)
Yes. Exactly.
Jennifer Fugo (40:38.209)
So I love the fact that you have this, because this is what you do. You share about this on Instagram, you have a podcast called Nutrition for Littles.
Alyssa (40:48.082)
That’s right.
Jennifer Fugo (40:50.482)
So if people want to get to know you better, they can find you in these two spots. And then is there anything specific that anybody needs to know about the training?
Alyssa (40:59.167)
No, I think it’s, the feedback we get from it all the time, it’s 100% free, there’s so much in it. I cover a lot, so be prepared. There’s a workbook, which I think is really helpful. But I get, probably daily, if not, every other day, feedback from people saying the exercise, the one we’re dancing around right now, I don’t want to spoil it for anybody, but I think you’re really gonna enjoy it. It really helps with that perspective change and really to be able to cement it, and then being able to feed your kids after that is just so helpful.
Just, even for that, and again, empathy’s not the right word because I think, as parents, I’ve never met a parent who’s not empathetic for their kids, and understanding, but you’re just not able to see it. You’re just caught up in your daily grind, survival, trying to get food on the table, trying to get to work, trying to get home on time, trying to pick up your kids, don’t forget the school schedule and the crazy hair day on Thursday. I mean, it is, I laugh sometimes with my husband, where I’m like, how are we doing all this? Literally, how are we maintaining all of this at once? My brain is constantly dropping things. So it’s not that we’re not empathetic, it’s that we truly cannot understand and remember what it was like to be a kid, and then we’re just repeating cycles that we didn’t know we were. And it’s just so helpful to get out of your own space.
So if you’re struggling with a picky eater, a few things I want you to know, especially going into the training. While, yes, picky eating can be a phase, if it’s lasted long than, I like to say about six weeks, I think that it’s turned from a phase to a pattern. And so I think the biggest disservice that our culture, our communities do for us is try and convince parents that they are victim to their kids being picky, that they can’t do anything about it, that they can’t reverse it, that it’s just a phase and they’ll just have to kind of deal with it. Just feed them chicken nuggets and mac and cheese, and one day they’ll grow out of it. I think it’s such a disservice because we can’t control everything, right? Our kid is a whole other person who is gonna make their own decisions, and so while we can’t control them, we can control how we show up.
And there’s so much that parents just aren’t doing because they’re just not educated about it, it’s no one’s fault. No one taught you how to do this, no pediatrician taught you this. Oftentimes parents don’t even know what to do, in fact I call it the old way that most of us were parented around the table. It just isn’t serving us super well. So I just really want to encourage parents, it doesn’t have to go on as long as it could, and you can step into that, and there is a framework for reversing picky eating. I teach it to you in the training, it’s about 61 minutes long so just schedule it on your calendar, pop in an AirPod and just listen to it, it’s changed so many peoples’ lives, just the free training alone. So I’m really, really proud of it and I think it’s really well worth your time.
Jennifer Fugo (43:35.757)
Well, I will make sure to put a link to the free training in our show notes. That way, if you come across this upon the release of this episode or you find this a year later, anybody can get access to it. Because I just know how many people you have helped reverse, like where parents get to actually just make dinnertime, mealtime in general, so much easier and take that stress off, and that conflict, off their plates with dinner ideas for fussy eater. Because you don't need to carry around the burden, and feel like you're a failure, you know? I think we, it's become normalized in our culture to feel like a failure all the time at various different things. And let's try and shed that because that frees up energy for you to be a more present parent, to be with your kids, to enjoy mealtime.
Alyssa (44:25.487)
I love that, yeah.
Jennifer Fugo (44:28.948)
And I think meals, I'm from an Italian family. Mealtime is a big deal because that's what creates community, that's what creates this unity.
Alyssa (44:38.209)
Yep. I love that.
Jennifer Fugo (44:40.408)
So anyway, I'm so grateful for you. Thank you so much for making the time to be here and share all of this about picky eating and strategies for managing a fussy eater. I think this topic doesn't get talked about enough. And while it doesn't have anything to do with skin rashes, I think this goes hand in hand with a lot of the issues that parents are facing, whether they're listening to me about their own rash issues, but they got picky eater kids. So I think this is a universal problem. And I just feel like this is something that, if I can connect parents with somebody, especially that I trust. You are amazing, I know you, you're such a wonderful person and an amazing teacher. And I just appreciate you for being you.
Alyssa (45:16.447)
Aw, and literally right back at you. I’m so grateful to have been able to come on the show and I just appreciate everything that you do, and I think you summarized it so beautifully. And you’re right, it’s such a big part of our culture to spend time and meals together and break bread, and that’s not changing. And so a lot of times parents, you know, I’ll just get through it, I’ll just get through it and it’s like, well, you’re probably feeding your kid three times a day plus a few snacks, that’s a lot of just getting through it. It’s not like bedtime that comes once a day, it’s not, even potty training, it’s like, okay, a few times a day. This is so much of your day, is spent feeding your kids and trying to enjoy meals, so I think it’s so worth the time. But, yeah, I just so appreciate you having me on, that was such a great conversation, I loved it.
Jennifer Fugo (45:58.701)
Awesome, well thank you so much Alyssa and I hope you can come back sometime.
Alyssa (46:00.387)
That’s right. And you on my podcast
Jennifer Fugo (46:05.387)
Yes, please.
Alyssa (46:06.973)
That’s right.
